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269 points by kaycebasques · 156 comments

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japgolly

Apply #[non_exhaustive] to publicly-exposed enums seems like a crazy recommendation to me. So much of the power of enums is that when you add a new case the compiler will flag all pattern matches that you need to update, which is a good thing because you're forced to consider each case. Having a catch-all saves dev-time but it risks not appropriately handling new cases becoming a runtime issue instead of a compile time error.

  • Thom2000

    FWIW the lint `non_exhaustive_omitted_patterns` will help a bit: https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/89554

  • rendaw

    What people seem to be missing here is that enums are just a reflection of functionality. If you make your enum non exhaustive then add a field, and something stops working because it's now missing critical messages, it's still a breaking change!

    It's always up to callers to decide to handle everything, or decide that additions are non-fatal and use a wildcard branch to ignore them. The same enum could need to be exhaustive for one use case, or subset matched by another.

  • ninkendo

    The corollary to your point is that you have to be extremely cautious what enums you make into public API if you want to be serious about backwards compatibility… likely wanting to include more flexible variants like “unknown” or “generic”, to make your API more flexible. But this ends up being the same problem by a different name, because it still turns things into runtime bugs, just like non-exhaustive enums do.

    It’s the eternal struggle between flexibility and strictness that doesn’t really have a silver bullet answer. Or maybe it’s better framed as “flexibility, safety, backwards compatibility, pick any two”?

  • i2talics

    It's a double edged sword because without #[non_exhaustive], adding a variant becomes a major semver breaking change. It depends on your priorities. I think that there is probably a subtle difference between enums that are expected to gain variants in minor releases (a common example is error types) and enums that are expected to be closed (something like Option or SocketAddr).

    Honestly what I tend to see is that most enums are not exposed publicly at all besides maybe error types and configuration options (where the user usually constructs but does not match on them). In both cases #[non_exhaustive] is valid. For all of the non-public enums you get to enjoy the compiler exhaustiveness enforcement.

  • akshayshah

    Sensible attitude for a one-team codebase, but much harder in a google3-sized megarepo…plus the policy matches protobuf enum semantics.

  • Groxx

    It's usually not too hard to work around stuff like this - wrap it and map it to an exhaustive type, and use tests to ensure that your `unreachable!()` is correct.

  • quotemstr

    This is from the people who make mandatory protobuf fields "optional".

    I just fundamentally disagree with Google on how to evolve data structures. Sloppy open-domain protobuf field presence, enum values, whatever are illusory extension points. Better to have discrete versions of a data structure --- Foo1, Foo2, Foo3, etc., and rigid checking in each one than to have just one "Foo" with optional-everything that changes implicitly over time.

  • zeroCalories

    Why? Their justification seems reasonable to me. If other teams depend on your enum then you could end up in two really bad cases. First is that you end up having to fix a ton of code just to update your enum, which has it's own headaches. Second is another team's build starts to fail when they update dependencies. Horrible churn to cause for your org. Better to just have them design around non_exhaustive.

monocasa

Can anyone expand on the chromium specifc guidelines on super tiny crates, particularly no nesting of modules/source files?

That feels like the ~2010 era of people saying that functions should be as small as possible. That lead me to reviewing a lot of code where every function was one or two lines and you couldn't actually see what was going on anymore through the layers of unneeded abstraction.

I want to give chrome the benefit of the doubt, but that seems really goofy.

  • evmar

    In Cargo-built Rust, a crate is costly in terms of abstraction because it needs its own directory, Cargo.toml, src/ subdir, etc. In the Google build systems I've worked with in the past (and it looks like Chromium follows) they instead put source files in the same directory mixing languages and with finer-grained libraries as they see fit.

    Given that a crate is the unit of build parallelization in Rust, there's a benefit to more crates especially when they don't cost much cognitive overhead. You could imagine using crates in the way you'd typically use separate mods in a normal Rust project.

    I dug around in their code search to find some examples but didn't see much Rust in there, seems still early. I think https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:tes... has ~4 Rust files that end up separate crates though. (One of them defines a proc macro so even in a Cargo built Rust project it would need to be in its own separate crate, I think!)

  • skohan

    It might have to do with optimizing compile times. A crate is the unit of compilation, so small crates increase the likelihood that you won't end up recompiling a lot of unrelated code.

    I guess smaller crates and avoiding nested modules could also help optimize for making the code greppable by coding agents without blowing up context windows.

  • i2talics

    The granularity of crates shouldn't really impact what kinds of abstractions you build. You can still have as many modules and types as you need, and as big of functions as you need, but its saying you should organize the modules into separate crates instead of one large crate. They even call out the trait coherence rules, saying that you can just make your library bigger instead of forcing a more awkward design in the pursuit of a smaller crate.

    I think one benefit of small crates is that it gives you more granularity in linking and dependency graphs, which is especially relevant for rebuilds. At a previous job we had a monolithic "utilities" crate, and this caused problems when you tried to depend on it for the IP address utilities but this brought in the radio frequency utilities. When one of these submodules got an update the versioning would excessively propagate downstream to every consumer. If this was organized as small "net-utils" and "rf-utils" crates then maybe it would not have been as much of an issue.

  • vvillena

    This being Google, I assume everything goes into a single gigantic monorepo that gets thrown at Blaze. If the unit of compilation is the crate, it makes sense for them to prefer that crates are as small as possible.

  • loeg

    Maybe one or two line functions are a totally different scale than "all source code files in a crate"? So like, one is problematic in a way the other is not. And the guidance is "prefer small," not "always super tiny." See: "Larger crates are allowed" later on. And also see: "Rationale: Fine-grained library targets are recommended in Chromium due to the massive size of our codebase, non-local effects of adding dependencies in the build graph, and to improve performance of parallel compilation and build caching."

  • pornel

    You get stricter enforcement of public APIs and dependencies. You can't import anything you haven't declared as a dep, and cycles are impossible. Rustdoc by default shows only your intended public API.

    OTOH if you have one crate with lots of modules, it's tempting to import anything anywhere and use pub(crate). Rustdoc needs to be configured to show private items if you want to see internal APIs.

    • tcdent

      Exactly. Being able to organize your code in a way that provides distinct responsibilities per crate is just good practice.

      And then the ability to enforce a formalized layer between crates and the way that they assemble into your application (i.e. the public API) is powerful for comprehension and maintainability. I go as far as documenting each crate with its own README that presents it as a standalone component with usage instructions, much like an open source library, even if it's only ever used in a single system.

  • skavi

    Forces better code structure in my experience (ignoring orphan rule). modules can have dependency cycles and things get tangled together. crates disallow cycles.

  • hugmynutus

    blaze/bazel doesn't support incremental crate compilation. It also can't, by design, as incremental compilation depends on incremental change to local build artifacts which isn't deterministic.

    So a single crate has to be as small as possible so builds are fast & cachable.

  • dnautics

    Compilation speed?

epage

> Type names should be imported and used unqualified

This just pushes people to have redundant information in types (`IoError` instead of `io::Error`).

Unless a type is widely recognized (like `HashMap`), I prefer to have them fully qualified so I have the contextual meaning for it. If I am working with a generic name like `Source`, what does that mean? I shouldn't have to look up in the imports to understand the code (or only understand it through an LSP).

Reducing imports also reduces unnecessary merge conflicts.

  • Blikkentrekker

    It says below that that in cases of things like `io::Error` it should be used as that though, as in “cases of ambiguities”. It specifically speaks of not using `regex::Regex` but just `Regex` which seems more reasonable to me.

    • B-Con

      Google's style guides tend to reduce namespace redundancy.

      Everyone remembers finding some hideous name like foo.widget.widgetBuilder.widgetFactory in Java or something. It's nice to have naming rules, or at least guidelines, focused on trimming redundancy and keeping the signal high.

    • epage

      That guideline is in response to an API design. I'm speaking to how the default stance (import types) feeds back into API design.

  • wtetzner

    Honestly I think having blanket rules in either direction is a bad idea. Sometimes it makes sense to qualify things, sometimes it's clearer if you don't.

preommr

Google has lost a lot of it's sheen for me. It's not really the 2010s anymore where their brand really used to mean something as a step above all the other tech companies.

Nowadays, I care about their recommendations as much as the ones from microsoft, or ibm.

Still big companies, lots of smart people, but nothing above norm.

afdbcreid

Here's a tip most Rust users don't know about extension traits: if you put `#[rust_analyzer::prefer_underscore_import]` above your trait (and you're using rust-analyzer and not RustRover), autocompletion and the import assist will import the trait `as _` by default, which is very useful for extension traits.

eviks

> out of automatic formatting using #[rustfmt::skip], but only in the following situations:

> Manual alignment

Guess, another decade before Rust robots can do columns?

JoeDohn

This is nice, I have been lurking on google and meta rust projects, mimicking and picking style by prompting LLMs to distill it, taking a look at fmt & clippy configs helps too.

But it wasn't as coherent and reliable from project to project like this guide. Kudos to google on this one !

tcallred

I really appreciate that they distinguish between library code and application code. Rust gets too much of a bad rap for its complicated generic code, but in most application scenarios you are not writing code nearly that complex or generic.

i2talics

Much of this is very standard across the Rust ecosystem but it's very helpful to have it all in one place.

petcat

At this point, is anybody writing new C or C++? It seems like they are sunset languages even at the big corps.

  • fasterik

    I'm pretty sure most big software projects (Windows, Linux, Chrome, gcc, LLVM, AAA game engines, ...) are still writing a lot of new C and C++. Pretty much everyone in the embedded world is as well.

    As a solo programmer, I still prefer C and C++. In fact, as I've incorporated LLMs in to my workflow, I've been increasingly drawn toward C and its simplicity. A lot of the QoL features of C++ simply aren't needed when you're writing less code manually.

    • loeg

      Using LLMs to write C feels a little silly to me. (Unless you really need C.) LLMs are still imperfect; you're still going to get a lot of UB bugs like human-authored C.

      • Groxx

        Particularly because so much of the code they're trained on has those flaws.

    • anthk

      Chrome should be ported to Rust long ago. on Windows, half of the UI can migrate tomorrow with ease.

      • boredatoms

        With the ram shortage they could start by removing all the web-views that should have been native

  • npalli

    Far from it. Until Rust can read C++ code seamlessly, there will be more code written in C++ than Rust for the foreseeable future. HPC, Finance, AI, Games, Databases, Hardware all continue to be written in C++.

    • simonask

      Serious people in all of those industries are thinking about whether and how Rust is a fit for their needs.

      Like, I agree that C++ will be around for a long while, but the writing is on the wall.

      • loeg

        I agree momentum for Rust is growing, but disagree that it is obvious the writing is on the wall for C++. Like, Java and C# didn't kill C++, either. In all likelihood, these languages will all coexist for a long, long time.

      • 20k

        For game development its hard to see how Rust can really replace C++ in practice. It'll take 15 years at minimum to replace the current development ecosystem for building games

      • npalli

        Strange position in 2026. If there is any writing in the wall it is this. Nobody is going to be writing Rust code from scratch given where LLMs are already now, much less in 5 years. A golden rule of software is fresh coding is a small part of the lifecycle most of it is maintenance. You may be able to get people to write Rust code (vibe code it), however a tiny minority of them will want to maintain LLM generated Rust code!! Rust will most likely be an intermediate representation - a security/formality check of sort - before converted into the appropriate heterogenous code across GPU/CPU/TPU/XPUs. Even there some other better representation will supplant it as Rust's ideas will be found too limiting. The idea that you as a programmer will sit and write Rust source code is just going to look very archaic. Thank god for LLMs for saving everyone just in time.

  • xedrac

    Unfortunately for me, yes. Some companies are very risk adverse and would rather stick with the devil they know. They have no idea what they are sacrificing.

  • geertj

    In a few years, Claude Mythos will be remembered as the moment C++ died. I am serious, very senior people are really scared of LLM found vulnerabilities and are pushing strongly for Rust.

  • j1elo

    Today I went over a TODO comment from 2007 in a C++ codebase that is still evolving very vividly, year after year. Trust me, for well established projects C++ is there to stay.

  • skohan

    C/C++ is still relevant for HPC, where you want to carefully optimize memory management.

    • vlovich123

      Hate to break it to you but Rust is equally capable of doing all the same memory management optimizations.

      • skohan

        I mean you can, but C/C++ is way more ergonomic for dealing with memory layouts.

        • Philpax

          Is it? How so?

          • FuckButtons

            It doesn’t have a stable abi, how could it be easier? I would argue that the vast majority of what rust gives you comes at a direct cost of precisely the ergonomics of manual memory management. It’s a tradeoff that makes sense much of the time, but it’s still very obviously a tradeoff.

            • vlovich123

              It’s easier in that you can cordon off the tricky parts being unsafe and define safe mechanics. Proof point: the Linux kernel using more and more rust and at once the platform support gets there more if the core memory management and what not will start getting ported too.

              There’s also work actively ongoing to make certain constructs even easier to express more ergonomically and letting user programs implement some of the magic that’s currently restricted to the standard library

          • smj-edison

            You don't have to deal with Rust's aliasing rules for &mut and &.

  • redox99

    Console/PC gaming is mostly C++ (and scripting/blueprints/etc).

  • loeg

    Plenty of new C++ going on at my BigCorp employer.

  • tkz1312

    I've been extracting a lot of verified C from theorem provers recently.

  • pjmlp

    Games, anything that depends on LLVM, GCC, CUDA, SYSCL,....

    Ah and Rust's compiler backend dependency on LLVM and in the future GCC as well.

  • neutronicus

    C++ seems alive and well in the defense space. The big contractors near me have tons of C++ job postings and I don't think I've seen a single one looking for Rust.

    • tormeh

      The new drone companies seem to favor Rust more. Helsing sponsors a lot of Rust conferences and stuff. Quantum Systems has job postings for embedded Rust. For companies that don't have a lot of legacy influencing their decisions, Rust is pretty much always going to be in their software stack. The big primes will probably come around to it in a decade or so.

    • thomashabets2

      Do you know if the code bases are of the kind where dynamic memory (among many other features) is disallowed?

      • 3eb7988a1663

        Defense industry can work around that.

          This sparked an interesting memory for me.  I was once working with a customer who was producing on-board software for a missile.  In my analysis of the code, I pointed out that they had a number of problems with storage leaks.  Imagine my surprise when the customers chief software engineer said "Of course it leaks".  He went on to point out that they had calculated the amount of memory the application would leak in the total possible flight time for the missile and then doubled that number.  They added this much additional memory to the hardware to "support" the leaks.  Since the missile will explode when it hits its target or at the end of its flight, the ultimate in garbage collection is performed without programmer intervention.
        
        https://devblogs.microsoft.com/oldnewthing/20180228-00/?p=98...
      • neutronicus

        Some of them, probably.

        From the job postings, many of them seem to be physics simulations of various kinds where (in my experience) memory is allocated on the heap without a second thought. Well, there are second thoughts, but those second thoughts are about performance.

    • debo_

      C++ requires defensive programming, so I guess it fits that defense requires C++ programming.

  • m00dy

    Rust is eating C/C++.

  • pornel

    Cloudflare is all in on Rust, it's used everywhere by default, and C++ leftovers are being actively torn down.

  • IshKebab

    Yes mine is, because they have a huge amount of C++ already and none of it is publicly accessible so security isn't a concern. (Obviously there are many other reasons to prefer Rust, but that is a big one.)

wocram

There's something ironic with having project specific variants in a style guide.

oddCopper65

The enum-over-bool rule is the one I'd keep even solo, saved me a reversed flag in a cert validator once.

  • sebastianconcpt

    This is a sub-case of the general one that is narrowing the interpretation of things. A big infinite amount of things can be true or false, only one can be a Rust variant.

hitekker

> Don’t use async / .await in Chromium.

That's pretty direct. IIRC, the Rust for Linux people also have that refrain informally

incrediblers

Getters and setters is the one I'm most at disagreement with.

   // Mine
   let label = Label.text("Hello Wold");
   let label_text = label.get_text();

   // Theirs
   let label = Label.set_text("Hello Wold");
   let label_text = label.text();
A method is a way to accomplish a specific task. Emphasis on specific not generic. The getter task is to always return. The setter task is specific. So the method should be the setter - `text`, `color`, `fill`. In Rust the getter can't have same name, so prefix it. Not the other way around.
  • i2talics

    Their style is pervasive in Rust, such as in the standard library, so I would personally apply a when-in-rome philosophy. FWIW something like `.text("hello")` I would expect to see in a builder-pattern but not in a setter for an object that's already built.

    That being said I don't particularly understand your conception of a method. They are both methods. The getter ought to have a shorter name since it is probably called more frequently and because it inherently has less of an impact -- this goes along with the principle that names that demand attention should be larger and easier to notice.

    • incrediblers

      My use case is a TUI framework (https://www.incredible.rs/). The setters configure elements in a chain-able manner. I grappled with the rust convention and decided to go the other way. Rational as mentioned.

      But this made me think...

      > "The getter ought to have a shorter name since it is probably called more frequently"

      So i checked. Rough agent driven counts:

      https://github.com/ronilan/incredible-flappy 407 setters and 183 getters.

      https://github.com/ronilan/rusticon 546 setters and 5 getters

      https://github.com/ronilan/shape-sorting 688 setters and 33 getters.

      And in a code editor with a lot of ui configurations based on reusable elements 2865 setters and 206 getters.

      In reactive apps on state handlers call on setters with state values. No getters involved...

      • afdbcreid

        That means those are probably builders and not setters. Do they change an existing object or a newly-constructed or to-be-constructed object?

        • incrediblers

          They are setters. They modify an element after instantiation. Mostly as part of the initial build, but then also in the event closure. Under the hood, a struct with interiorly mutable fields.

          • i2talics

            This sounds a lot like a builder but the line can be blurry. For a Rust stdlib example, the `process::Command` type is considered a builder even though it is not named "CommandBuilder", and the final operation is spawning a subprocess, not returning some other data.

            • incrediblers

              What I was saying is that I think a "flipped pattern" where anything that sets something sometime somewhere is the word and anything that reads is a get_* makes this fine distinction unnecessary... and that makes life easier... I came to Rust from JS where one can overload methods... I understand from other comments that the set_* convention may have arrived from C++... In any case, consistency I think beats specifics.

          • fwip

            Gotcha, so in your case, users of the library will set values much more often than read them (since the reading will be done by the TUI framework for display).

  • trimbo

    This style is aligned with protocol buffers, which is aligned with the style of protos in C++.

    https://protobuf.dev/reference/rust/rust-generated/

  • epage

    I think which to use in general Rust code depends on the purpose of your type.

    A builder type like `Command` will have unqualified setters and `get_` qualified getters.

    For record-like-structs, I think unqualified getters becomes preferred and `set_` qualified setters.

slaymaker1907

I have a huge disagreement here. You should absolutely be using Arc and Rc for any references *that live outside of the call stack.*

Don't do weird crap with lifetimes to try and convince the compiler that what you're doing is ok, just throw Rc/Arc on it and be done with it.

The Rc/Arc advice also applies to C++ IMO, though you use different constructs, std::shared obviously, but there is a strong argument to be made for a std::shared_st or something which is single threaded.

It would not surprise me if this advice comes from experience with C++ where there is no Rc so reference counting is very expensive. Even so, you can greatly reduce the expense by passing things by ref where lifetimes are simple which is the vast majority of the time.

  • i2talics

    I think using refcounting can allow you to get lazy with your object graphs, throwing referencing to objects around everywhere and then losing the ability to conceptualize who owns what and who is responsible for who (so to speak). Sticking to a stricter ownership graph forces you to be more deliberate with how your types are designed and this can lead to better architecture in the long run.

  • mrbonner

    Agree. I think for the limited scopes such as in a mod/function, using Rust's borrow checker semantic makes sense as it is easier to fit in our mental model. If you have to pass those data structures around to the outside of your limited scopes, I would prefer Rc/ARc more. I also think the style guide has a catch all phrase there when it says "OK to use Rc/ARc depending on the complexity...". For me, having to pass a shared reference around is enough complexity to reason about.

  • wtetzner

    I find using lifetimes to be simpler and easier to follow than reference counting, unless you're in a situation where you actually need a shared lifetime.

    Adding Rc/Arc is just another layer of indirection and noise that makes the code hard to read.

manlymuppet

How useful would this be to simply feed to an LLM and say to follow strictly?

  • threethirtytwo

    Not useful at all. It uses up context. You need all the context you can get for the LLM read the code later for you later.

    • JimTheMan

      Could you just get a separate agent to do a pass over existing code and make conform? Like super linting.

      Not a professional programmer, so it's a genuine question rather than a statement.

      • threethirtytwo

        Sure you can do that. But what’s the practical point if only your agent is reading it? Your agent doesn’t care about linting.

mmooss

> Usage of lowercase alphabets in hex literals (0xab123cdef as opposed to 0xAB123CDEF): hex_literal_case = Lower

Anytime numbers and letters are mixed, it's more readable if the letters are lowercase. It's easier to read the variable heights - numbers are usually capital letter height, sometimes with descenders - and avoids confusing 0O, I1, even 8B and 5S (think of a degraded printed serial number, poor lighting, etc.). There's only l problem that persists.

  • IX-103

    OT, but it was interesting. Some old typewriters didn't have a separate 1 a lower case L key. They had keys for the other numbers, but you were expected to just type a lower case L for 1.

younglunaman

ctrl+c > ctrl+v > into my AGENTS.md for my next rust project /s

xiaodai

why is google using github, a Micro$oft product?

  • shaftway

    I 100% guarantee that this source of truth for this is either in google3 or git-on-borg and is being mirrored to GitHub for external use. There aren't a lot of public catch-all repos or public micro repos published by Google. Given that, GitHub is a reasonable choice.

holografix

Things like this make me appreciate Gofmt so much

  • japgolly

    But there's a rustfmt already. Anyway, the style guide is larger in scope than just code formatting.

Thanemate

Not trying to rain on someone's parade but, the only reason why would care about style guides nowadays is to feed them to our model of choice and let it do what it's supposed to be doing.

So it's not like I am willing to read through this and think to myself "I cannot wait to pick up some new ways of doing things". I'm the general to my agentic army now.

I guess you would code manually every now and then for your own enjoyment but at that point do you care about style guides written for scale?

  • nimih

    I'm not sure I really agree with your main point (I think it's probably still important for LLM-generated code to be generally human-understandable, at least if you care about long-term maintainability), but setting that aside to answer this question:

    > I guess you would code manually every now and then for your own enjoyment but at that point do you care about style guides written for scale?

    I think they're still quite valuable in that case, for a couple reasons:

    - When learning a new language (which happens much more frequently when writing code "for pleasure," as it were), "written for scale" guidelines still translate pretty well to "written for oneself" IME. At the very least, they tell you what to expect in code you read, and give you a reasonable starting point as you develop your own taste and stylistic preferences.

    - I've noticed some open source projects beginning to institute anti-AI contribution guidelines, and such projects still benefit from codified style guides. Google obviously doesn't fall under this category themselves, but in other language ecosystems, their style guides tend to find use in OSS projects.

  • anonymous908213

    > I'm the general to my agentic army now.

    What have you produced with your agentic army? Would you like to share with the class?

    • bigfishrunning

      my guess is a lot of heat, some water vapor....

    • solyin

      Why would they when the class is full of dropouts who, generously, have a 0 percent chance of going "hey, y'know what, that's actually kinda cool! I'm going to change my mind about LLMs being useless" and a 100% chance of going "ur project is total shit and you should feel bad".

      • nvme0n1p1

        The people you call "dropouts" have written 100% of the software that people actually use and actually keeps the real world running, so maybe you shouldn't write them off.

        • lioeters

          The "all in on LLM" hypesters are as obnoxious as the "all in on Rust" hipsters.

          We get it, Rust is great, and LLMs too. But sometimes it's like listening to teenage philosophers who just discovered atheism, who go on and on to disparage all religions every chance they get. They're so full of themselves that they don't realize they're missing entire areas of understanding about the world and people.

          The juvenile arrogance on display in many threads in recent years is second-hand embarrassing. Meanwhile the greybeards continue getting the job done, with or without LLMs, in Rust, C++ or even C.

        • solyin

          Class is full of dropouts != every single last member of the class is a dropout.

        • scottyah

          Unlike Linus, Jeff Dean, DHH, John Carmack, Guido van Rossum? I really want to know who you think writes "100% of the software that people actually use and actually keeps the real world running"

          • nvme0n1p1

            Have any of those people (excluding DHH) said anything even half as ridiculous as "I'm the general to my agentic army now"? Or are they adults using tools where they make sense and avoiding them where they don't?

            If you think style guides don't matter anymore, I encourage you to submit patches to the people on your list whose credibility you're borrowing, and see if they agree. Tell Linus to delete https://docs.kernel.org/process/coding-style.html because it doesn't matter because we have AI now. Or ask GvR if the current Python maintainers should deprecate https://peps.python.org/pep-0008/, since agents don't need it.

          • vor_

            Linus doesn't even do much programming by his own admission. He's a release manager.

            • japgolly

              That being said there was a story about him debugging an issue recently with some pretty serious help from AI.

          • Mawr

            Hmm, one of those is not like the others...

  • smoe

    First paragraph: “includes guidance on API and implementation design”

    It seems to me that if the intent is not just to produce code but also to operate it, having the different pieces behave in a similar, predictable way is kind of nice. Whether the software is written by AI or humans.

  • u1hcw9nx

    Not trying to rain on someone's parade, but the only reason I would care about HN comments nowadays is to feed them to my model of choice and let it generate the contrarian hot takes it's supposed to be generating. So it's not like I am willing to read through this thread and think to myself "I cannot wait to pick up some new ways of complaining about documentation." I'm the Editor-in-Chief to my synthetic pundit army now.

    I guess you would type out a comment manually every now and then for your own enjoyment, but at that point do you really care about comments at scale?

    ---

    EDIT (above is a joke) It's very important that every time you find something that is of no use to you, you write a comment explaining that this link is of no interest to you, discouraging people from things you have no interest in. Monoculture for all!

  • yodsanklai

    This is what we do in my company, give the guidelines to the model. Unfortunately, the model isn't always following them and it's impossible to enforce them manually. There's too much code to review, the code is generally low quality, and is more often than not auto-approved by AI.

    Unless you're working on your own project on which you have full control, or you have a strong authority figure in your company who cares about that, it's a lost battle.

    It's sad for anyone who love their craft, but tbh I'm not even sure it matters anymore for most projects.

    • scottyah

      Either you can put it in a linter and automate/force it, or people/agents will take liberties. I feel like there's usually exceptions where a well-meaning guideline doesn't properly fit a specific scenario.

  • monocasa

    The point of style guides is to optimize for readability despite a cognitively diverse workforce coding in the same repos.

    I would think they're probably even more meaningful in an agentic world.

    Shitty generals can't review meaningfully review the work of their troops.

    On top of that all, I just enjoy programming itself. It's less and less of the meat of a software job over time, but I was coding before I got paid for it, and I'll probably keep coding well after I can get paid for it.

    • mkagenius

      > Shitty generals can't review meaningfully review the work of their troops.

      Except that reviewing has become just asking your agent what that piece of code does in english. Reading code has a bit of cognitive load, that we will probably drop it in coming years

  • petersellers

    Are you saying that you don't ever look at the code once it's been generated?

    • bigstrat2003

      AI bros think you can never look at code and make good software. They're wrong, of course, but they refuse to listen and will probably never listen until the shoddy quality of their work becomes too great to paper over.

      • IX-103

        If you set up a really good AI code review pipeline then you can get pretty close. I've heard a couple of tech companies are targeting 80% of changes not needing human review and they'll probably scale up from there.

  • gatlin

    Seems very much like your goal was to rain on a parade.

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