Ursula von der Leyen: "We have no bros and no oligarchs"

Lesen Sie diesen Text auf Deutsch 

DIE ZEIT: Tariffs up, tariffs down, arms deliveries yes, no, the war in Ukraine is still going on – how are you doing, Ms von der Leyen?

Ursula Von der Leyen: Well. If I had been asked a few years ago if this kind of situation were possible, I would never have believed it. But such situations also help us to focus on the essentials. What matters is that I have to keep the 27 Member States coordinated and give guidance. I need to have – or develop – a plan for each crisis. And it is important that we move forward very pragmatically and very quickly, because people expect Europe to be there for them. So it has a momentum of its own that does not leave you much time to think about how you are doing.

ZEIT: There has been nothing but crises since you took office, isn't that right?

Von der Leyen: Yes. I had been in office for 90 days when the WHO declared COVID-19 a global pandemic. We weren't yet back on our feet when Putin attacked Ukraine. Soon after, we got into the worst energy crisis we've ever had because Putin shut off the gas. And now we have a transatlantic crisis. So yes, there has been one crisis after another.

ZEIT: What has changed since the start of your, and Donald Trump's, second term?

Von der Leyen: The changes have been historic. The EU has grown mainly by looking inwards; we have created open internal borders, a single market, a single currency and freedom of movement. And we assumed that economic and political freedom would eventually converge and that this would unite people. When the Wall fell in 1990, the end of history was proclaimed. Now history is back, and so are geopolitics. And we see that what we had perceived as a world order is becoming a world disorder, triggered not least by the power struggle between China and the United States, but of course also by Putin's imperialist ambitions. That is why we need another, new European Union that is ready to go out into the big wide world and to play a very active role in shaping this new world order that is coming.

ZEIT: The most surprising thing was that not only did Putin attack, but also the United States, what would you call it now? Under old divorce laws, this might have been called malicious abandonment ...

Von der Leyen: (Laughs) In recent years, the need for a wake-up call has often been articulated. Today, I would say that Europe is awake – wide awake. And we have very clearly outlined that we have to go much further forward in two areas: building our own defence capability and improving our competitiveness. There is strong political momentum and a willingness within the EU to break new ground in a very creative way. The fact that we are now providing EUR 800 billion in funding for military capabilities would have been unthinkable just a few years ago. The readiness of all 27 Member States to strengthen our common defence industry would have been inconceivable without the developments of recent weeks and months. The same applies to the economy. Everyone wants to emulate our common plan for greater competitiveness, because everyone has understood: We need to stand firm in today's globalised world.

ZEIT: Kaja Kallas, the Union's foreign affairs representative, said after Volodymyr Zelensky was expelled from the White House: "The free world needs a new leader." Are you the leader of the free world now?

Von der Leyen: I don't like these labels ...

ZEIT: ...the quote does not come from us, but from Ms Kallas ...

Von der Leyen: For me, it is crucial that Europe plays a strong role in shaping the new world order that is slowly emerging. And I firmly believe that Europe can do that. Let's look back at the last decade: the banking crisis, migration crisis, Brexit, pandemic, energy crisis, Russia's war against Ukraine. All these are serious crises that have really challenged us, but Europe has emerged bigger and stronger from every crisis. And people have learned that when there are big crises, Europe certainly provides some of the big answers. That gives you confidence. And secondly: Europe has always managed the crises as a team.

ZEIT: You have just given the question of whether you are the new leader of the Western world a wide berth. But don't you have to accept that Europe – the EU, with you at its head – has recently become the most important guarantor of Western values in the world?

Von der Leyen: The West as we knew it no longer exists. The world has become a globe also geopolitically, and today our networks of friendship span the globe, as you can see in the debate about tariffs. A positive side effect is that I am currently having countless talks with heads of state and government around the world who want to work together with us on the new order. This is true from Iceland to New Zealand, from Canada to the United Arab Emirates, as it is for India, Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines, Thailand, Mexico, and South America. Right now, I could have these conversations 24 hours a day. Everyone is asking for more trade with Europe – and it's not just about economic ties. It is also about establishing common rules and it is about predictability. Europe is known for its predictability and reliability, which is once again starting to be seen as something very valuable. On the one hand, this is very gratifying; on the other hand, there is also of course a huge responsibility that we have to live up to.

ZEIT: The West no longer exists. Does this mean a final farewell to the United States?

Von der Leyen: I am a great friend of the United States of America, a convinced Atlanticist. I firmly believe that the friendship between Americans and Europeans remains. But the new reality also includes the fact that many other states are seeking to draw closer to us. 13% of global trade is with the United States. That's a lot. 87% of the world's trade is with other countries. And they all want predictability and reliable rules. Europe can deliver that. We must now use this momentum to open up new markets for our companies and establish as close a relationship as possible with many countries that have the same interests as us.