Echo Station: Interview With James Gurney

"Breathe Deep, Seek Peace"

Controversial Similarities Between "Dinotopia" and "The Phantom Menace"
Including Discussion With The Author, James Gurney

Interview by Loren Phillips
6/6/99

The "Star Wars" films have always been about imagery.

When George Lucas first presented his universe to the world, it was not a simple story that took away the breath of his audiences, it was the phenomenal visual presentation accomplished on a scale never seen before.  From the opening scene of the original film, showing an unimaginably huge starship filling the movie screen, through the shocking first sight of Imperial Walkers in "The Empire Strikes Back", to the stunning and exciting duels of "The Phantom Menace" using deadly laser weapons, the true basis of the films has been to take the viewer to another place never seen before.   Lucas has always credited his stories as being largely influenced by many factors in his life, from the matinee films of "Buck Rogers" to the directorial works of Akira Kurosawa.  Never shy about discussing the folklore, mythology, and history that he has drawn upon, Lucas was always proud to have taken so many influences and congealed them into an exciting body of work known as "Star Wars". 

So when does drawing upon the creativity of another artist go too far?  That question has become the basis of what will probably be the most controversial issue surrounding "The Phantom Menace".  The heart of the matter leads us to a body of work by artist and author James Gurney, whose world known as Dinotopia has been loved around the world for many years.

The Internet is becoming awash in conversation on newsgroups, message boards, and websites, questioning whether James Gurney was involved in the preproduction conceptualization of particular scenes of the film.  In fact, Mr. Gurney himself received so much mail, it was necessary for him to publish a statement on his website, www.dinotopia.com, indicating that he was in no way involved in the production.  Questions continue to flood the internet, however, regarding how scenes in "Episode 1" could so closely resemble his work.

For those not familiar with "Dinotopia", the original book, "Dinotopia: A Land Apart From Time", was released in 1992, a New York Times best-seller, winner of the Hugo Award, Colorado Children's Book Award, The World Fantasy Award, and The Chelsey Award.  The second book of the series, "Dinotopia: The World Beneath", followed in 1995.  The books revolve around the story of a 19th century scientist and his son who are shipwrecked and explore the exotic island of Dinotopia, where they find humans and dinosaurs living together in a stunning world.  While the story was entertaining itself, it was the breathtaking illustrations that truly brought the reader into the world he had created.  "Dinotopia" has appeared in over 30 countries in 18 different languages, making it a globally known story. 

James Gurney's artistic talent has led to his illustrating over 70 science fiction and fantasy paperback book covers, including "Glory Lane" by Alan Dean Foster, numerous contributions to National Geographic Magazine, becoming animation background painter for the film "Fire and Ice" (1983), and U.S. Postage Stamp art ("Settling of Ohio, Northwest Territory"-1988, and "The World Of Dinosaurs"-1997, a commemorative pane of 15 stamps).  Artwork from Dinotopia has been exhibited in numerous tours around the United States. Needless to say, James Gurney is an extremely well-known and highly respected artist, likened to Jules Verne, H.G. Wells, N.C. Wyeth, and J.R.R. Tolkien, and known for bringing a perspective of realism and scientific accuracy to his work.

So how does all of this fit in the world of "Star Wars"?

Those familiar with Dinotopia have been stunned by certain similarities between Gurney's work and scenes in "The Phantom Menace".  Most notably, the final parade in the film is eerily like the illustration shown here, which was copyrighted in 1990, as well as his Waterfall City seeming like Theed (many scenes of which were reportedly cut from the film, but the establishing scenes are at similar angles), and a submarine journey in "The World Beneath" being similar to the the Jedi's trip through the core of the planet of Naboo, including the sub being bitten by a large dinosaur.  The "sidekick" character is a creature named Bix, which sounds very similar to Binks, as in Jar Jar Binks, the sidekick in "Menace".

A post June 3rd on the newsgroup alt.fan.starwars, by Jeff Rankine, is an excellent example.  He states, "I know there are obvious homages in Lucas' work, including the Metropolis robot (Threepio), and Dune.  In TPM, there are obvious examples, including the pod race (Ben Hur chariot race), and others.  I think that Lucas has stepped over the bounds, though, with Dinotopia, and is in the realm of stealing and plagiarism.  Consider that this is a series of books that Lucas has said he has read and is one of his son's favorites - and further that he sought no permission to use these images...Quite frankly, I think all the people who consider Lucas a visionary genius should think long and hard about this."

Examples of critical reviews stated the same.  From the Wilmington Morning Star, the film reviewer says "The idyllic planet of Naboo...was colonized from James Gurney's Dinotopia".  The film critic for the Colorado Springs Gazette, states "For these amazing designs, Lucas has borrowed from a wide away of sources.  For instance, his signature curtain-call scene (you'll find one in each 'Star Wars' film) is a parade that looks torn right off the pages of James Gurney's 'Dinotopia' books.  When it comes to knowing what material and styles are worth pilfering, Lucas has proved himself a master thief."

I had the pleasure of speaking to Mr. Gurney regarding this issue on June 5, 1999, who was kind enough to call me to discuss my review of the movie, in which I had mentioned the similarities, as well as the growing controversy.    Thankfully, he has given me permission to discuss our conversation, so that I may attempt to enlighten the public on the events and his perspective. 

James Gurney, an admitted Star Wars fan, said that when seeing the parade in "Episode 1" the first time, "I nearly dropped my popcorn, because I thought it looked so much like Dinotopia".  He's been receiving numerous telephone calls from people in the industry (production designers, authors, illustrators) stressing to him that the similarities have "gone too far".  Dads around his son's soccer field have been knocking on his car window asking if he's got a lawyer yet.  And yet Mr. Gurney seems to be taking it all very patiently, despite the overwhelming pressure to respond to the situation legally.

The connections between "Dinotopia" and "The Phantom Menace" aren't simply a matter of visual similarity.  A brief history from Mr. Gurney on the production of the upcoming Dinotopia motion picture drew an interesting picture for me of the events leading to this controversy, and a much clearer understanding of how this may have come about.

Columbia Pictures reached an option agreement in 1993 to make "Dinotopia" into a live action motion picture.  In 1994, George Lucas was approached by the producers with the Dinotopia film property in its developmental phase.  This meeting exposed Lucas to all of the conceptual elements of the "Dinotopia" film.  Since Industrial Light & Magic, Lucas' special effects production house, had just successfully produced the film "Jurassic Park", Lucas was reportedly confident that ILM could produce the important parade scene effectively with their existing technology.  Negotiations broke down, however, for business reasons, and the project returned to Columbia.

According to the Lucasfilm book "The Making of The Phantom Menace", Lucas began writing the screenplay "on the morning of November 1, 1994". This would have been approximately eight months after the "Dinotopia" meeting.  The book also states "Lucas had known the basic story lines for Episodes I, II, and III ever since he'd sat down to pen the original 'Star Wars' screenplay..." and Lucas commented "the backstory was sketched out in a rudimentary fashion when I wrote the first trilogy...A lot of the story points were there.  But the actual scenes and many of the characters were not."

After the project returned to Columbia in 1994, a senior visual effects director at ILM left with the approval of George Lucas to work as the director of the "Dinotopia" film.  Many effects and production design professionals, wishing to work with this director, also came to the project.  James Gurney contributed his artwork on speculation to assist the producers, including developing the look of Waterfall City for the film, using green domes, rather than the red tile roofs in the original books.

On March 7, 1997, the project stalled in turnaround, when new executives at Columbia halted the project.  One storyboard artist working on the "Dinotopia" project at Columbia subsequently joined Lucasfilm to work on character design, costume design, and storyboard art for "The Phantom Menace" project.

The special effects community, however, remained intrigued with "Dinotopia", despite its delay.  An article in "Variety" on May 8, 1998, entitled "Effects Gurus Reveal Favorite Dream Projects", featured Gurney's "Dinotopia Parade" painting, with the caption "James Gurney's classic book 'Dinotopia' is the perfect project for today's cutting-edge effects".  The article also included a quote by an ILM visual effects supervisor, stating he envisions books like "Dinotopia" as being one that "we're right on the cusp of being able to do".

Needless to say, I was taken aback at what had happened behind the scenes of these two films.  Mr. Gurney, however, seemed not at all hostile about the situation.  He told me that George Lucas had telephoned him the day after "The Phantom Menace" was officially released, despite the fact that they had no previous relationship, and although he could not discuss the conversation, he did say it was concerning the noticed similarities between the projects. 

He makes clear that the way the law is written, ideas cannot be copyrighted, so the expression of ideas, if slightly different, are a difficult issue to address.   "It takes a great leap of faith to present a story to a producer" in opening your portfolio of ideas to someone else.  Mr. Gurney's biggest concern seemed to be that when his "Dinotopia" film is finally released, people will look upon it as having copied scenes from "The Phantom Menace", when in fact it would not be true.  "It is hard," says Gurney, "for an original artist to release their film after a copy is released.  'The Phantom Menace' has its life...I want 'Dinotopia' to have its life, too."

How could this have been handled?  Gurney doesn't think using other people's influences is a bad thing, but "if someone is conscious of an influence, it would be right to contact the artist of the original work and invite them to discuss it".    Gurney, whose fan mail comes mostly from 8- to 12-year olds, doesn't want children who recognize this similarity to get the wrong impression that it is acceptable to copy someone else's work.

This past week has seen a large spike in traffic at www.dinotopia.com during this evolving controversy.   Interestingly enough, the second largest domain to visit the site during the spike has been Lucasfilm.com.  Certainly, the discussion occurring in the online Star Wars community has been responsible for much of this increased attention, and the news media is gradually beginning to address the situation as well.

When I asked if he would be against ILM working on his film now, Mr. Gurney expressed his utmost respect for George Lucas and ILM, and said it's still too early to say if ILM will work on the project.  He stressed to me to relay in this article that he is still a great fan of the creativity of George Lucas, and that he highly admires the work of Lucas and ILM. 

We talked about the concept of "imitation being the sincerest form of flattery".   If anything good comes from this entire situation, it will be a whole new generation of people being introduced to the world of "Dinotopia".  When Lucas talked about having been influenced by Kurosawa films, thousands went to their local video store to rent these films they had never seen before.  In turn, it is hopeful that the millions of people who admire George Lucas will recognize that the work of James Gurney was indeed a major influence on his filmmaking, and they'll explore yet another visually impressive and conceptually original "alternate universe".

James Gurney's two books are not the only basis for the world of "Dinotopia".   With a concept familiar to Star Wars fans, Gurney permitted several authors to expand upon the world he created, resulting in a series of books which take the reader to exciting new realms.  The first of these, "Dinotopia Lost", was penned by Alan Dean Foster, author of "Splinter of the Mind's Eye" and ghostwriter of the novelization of the original "Star Wars" film, who has since followed up with a new novel, "Hand of Dinotopia".  We encourage everyone to explore these books, as available at Dinotopia.com's web store, run by Gurney's 10-year-old son, Franklin, who processes all of the orders and keeps a large map with pins marking the places from which he's received them.   This is the one place you can easily see all of the available items, as well as being able to order signed copies of James Gurney's books, including one of his World of Dinosaurs stamp affixed to the title page and canceled with Gurney’s Artist Station postmark.  His newest book, "First Flight", to be release in October 1999, will take place 1000 years before the original book, and will include a built-in game board and gaming cards (publisher Harper Collins).

James Gurney seems to be a man trapped between what he wants to do and what others want him to do.  Throughout our conversation, I never got the impression that he had any desire to pursue any legal action over the situation.  Instead, he seems to simply be an artist who wants his own work recognized for the accomplishment that it is.  The millions of fans of "Dinotopia" have been familiar with this imagery for years, but there are millions of people who have seen "The Phantom Menace" who will eventually see "Dinotopia" on the theater screen and think it is just another attempt to copy the success of the "Star Wars" films.  Gurney doesn't want to see this impression in his own film's audience.  It comes down to a difficult choice - having to stay true to his books and make the film with this risk, or leaving behind his own original ideas and making the film appear different from "Episode 1".   This is not a position in which any artist should have to find themselves.

In the end, despite the fact that there will always be people who will think "The Phantom Menace" came first, I believe this situation will result in an increased audience for James Gurney.  Perhaps his world is full of dinosaurs, but it still an exciting new place that people like Star Wars fans, who long to travel to strange new places, will enjoy for years to come.  I look forward to seeing "Dinotopia" come to life on the theater screen, and hope that Mr. Gurney will stay true to his original vision, and tell the story as he always meant it to be. 

James Gurney will live by the theme of the world he has created, which is the motto "Breathe deep, seek peace".  Perhaps we should all learn to do the same.

(Loren Phillips is webmaster for EchoStation.com, along with her husband, David)

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