Garage – An S3 object store so reliable you can run it outside datacenters
garagehq.deuxfleurs.frLooks interesting for something like local development. I don't intend to run production object storage myself, but some of the stuff in the guide to the production setup (https://garagehq.deuxfleurs.fr/documentation/cookbook/real-w...) would scare me a bit:
> For the metadata storage, Garage does not do checksumming and integrity verification on its own, so it is better to use a robust filesystem such as BTRFS or ZFS. Users have reported that when using the LMDB database engine (the default), database files have a tendency of becoming corrupted after an unclean shutdown (e.g. a power outage), so you should take regular snapshots to be able to recover from such a situation.
It seems like you can also use SQLite, but a default database that isn't robust against power failure or crashes seems suprising to me.
I've been using minio for local dev but that version is unmaintained now. However, I was put off by the minimum requirements for garage listed on the page -- does it really need a gig of RAM?
The current latest Minio release that is working for us for local development is now almost a year old and soon enough we will have to upgrade. Curious what others have replaced it with that is as easy to set up and has a management UI.
That's not something you can do reliably in software, datacenter grade NVMe drives come with power loss protection and additional capacitors to handle that gracefully. If power is cut at the wrong moment the partition may not be mountable afterwards otherwise.
If you really live somewhere with frequent outages, buy an industrial drive that has a PLP rating. Or get a UPS, they tend to be cheaper.
Isn't that the entire point of write-ahead logs, journaling file systems, and fsync in general? A roll-back or roll-forward due to a power loss causing a partial write is completely expected, but surely consumer SSDs wouldn't just completely ignore fsync and blatantly lie that the data has been persisted?
As I understood it, the capacitors on datacenter-grade drives are to give it more flexibility, as it allows the drive to issue a successful write response for cached data: the capacitor guarantees that even with a power loss the write will still finish, so for all intents and purposes it has been persisted, so an fsync can return without having to wait on the actual flash itself, which greatly increases performance. Have I just completely misunderstood this?
you actually don't need capacitors for rotating media, Western Digital has a feature called "ArmorCache" that uses the rotational energy in the platters to power the drive long enough to sync the volatile cache to a non volatile storage.
https://documents.westerndigital.com/content/dam/doc-library...
Very cool, like the ram air turbine that deploys on aircraft in the event of a power loss.
> ignore fsync and blatantly lie that the data has been persisted
Unfortunately they do: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38371307
If the drives continue to have power, but the OS has crashed, will the drives persist the data once a certain amount of time has passed? Are datacenters set up to take advantage of this?
> will the drives persist the data once a certain amount of time has passed
Yes, otherwise those drives wouldn't work at all and would have a 100% warranty return rate. The reason they get away with it is that the misbehavior is only a problem in a specific edge-case (forgetting data written shortly before a power loss).
Yes, the drives are unaware of the OS state.
BTW https://deuxfleurs.fr/ is one of the most beautiful website I have ever seen
It's beautiful from an artistic point of view but also rather hard to read and probably not very accessible (haven't checked it, though, since I'm on my phone).
Seeing a ton of adoption of this after the Minio debacle
https://www.repoflow.io/blog/benchmarking-self-hosted-s3-com... was useful.
RustFS also looks interesting but for entirely non-technical reasons we had to exclude it.
Anyone have any advice for swapping this in for Minio?
I have not tried either myself, but I wanted to mention that Versity S3 Gateway looks good too.
https://github.com/versity/versitygw
I am also curious how Ceph S3 gateway compares to all of these.
I'd be curious to know how versitygw compares to rclone serve S3.
From what I have seen in the previous discussions here (since and before Minio debacle) and at work, Garage is a solid replacement.
Seaweed looks good in those benchmarks, I haven't heard much about it for a while.
> but for entirely non-technical reasons we had to exclude it
Able/willing to expand on this at all? Just curious.
Not the same person you asked, but my guess would be that it is seen as a chinese product.
RustFS appears to be very early-stage with no real distributed systems architecture: https://github.com/rustfs/rustfs/pull/884
I'm not sure if it even has any sort of cluster consensus algorithm? I can't imagine it not eating committed writes in a multi-node deployment.
Garage and Ceph (well, radosgw) are the only open source S3-compatible object storage which have undergone serious durability/correctness testing. Anything else will most likely eat your data.
What is this based on, honest question as from the landing page I don't get that impression. Are many committers China-based?
> Beijing Address: Area C, North Territory, Zhongguancun Dongsheng Science Park, No. 66 Xixiaokou Road, Haidian District, Beijing
> Beijing ICP Registration No. 2024061305-1
Oh, I misread the initial comment and thought they had to exclude Garage. Thanks!
No tags on objects.
Garage looks really nice: I've evaluated it with test code and benchmarks and it looks like a winner. Also, very straightforward deployment (self contained executable) and good docs.
But no tags on objects is a pretty big gap, and I had to shelve it. If Garage folk see this: please think on this. You obviously have the talent to make a killer application, but tags are table stakes in the "cloud" API world.
I love garage. I think it has applications beyond the standard self host s3 alternative.
It's a really cool system for hyper converged architecture where storage requests can pull data from the local machine and only hit the network when needed.
Corrupts data on power loss according to their own docs. Like what you get outside of data centers. Not reliable then.
I have been using Garage for Nix storage in my home lab. Easy to set up! I hope to see more self-hosted projects operate over S3 APIs (or at least support it) so that making redundant setups would be easier. It might sound very niche, but I can't see myself replacing many cloud or centralized services unless I can do redundant object storage -- compute is trivial with a load balancer.
One really useful usecase for Garage for me has been data engineering scripts. I can just use the S3 integration that every tool has to dump to garage and then I can more easily scale up to cloud later.
No erasure coding seems like a pretty big loss in terms of how much resources do you need to get good resiliency & efficiency
I was looking at using this on an LTO tape library, it seems the only resiliency is through replication, but this was my main concern with this project, what happens with HW goes bad
Wasn't expecting to see it hosted on forgejo. Kind of a breath of fresh air to be honest.
Does this support conditional PUT (If-Match / If-None-Match)?
Is it the same consistency model as S3? I couldn't see anything about it in their docs.
Unfortunately, this doesn’t support conditional writes through if-match and if-none-match [0] and thus is not compatible with ZeroFS [1].
https://git.deuxfleurs.fr/Deuxfleurs/garage/src/branch/main-...
this is the reliability question no?