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A Study of 4chan’s Politically Incorrect Forum and its Effect on the Web

arxiv.org

212 points by ivarious 10 years ago · 154 comments

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ivariousOP 10 years ago

It's rather disappointing that the authors didn't talk about the biggest thing that has reshaped discussion in 4chan since years.

The reply indicator.

For people who don't go to 4chan, you can read it on http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/you-here-s-your-you. Basically, if someone else replied to your post, the post pointer will show a (You) word, showing that the poster replied to a post that you wrote.

Moreover, the post number of posts that replied/quoted you will be attached to your own posts. Much-replied post will have a lot of link to the posts that replied them, and very visible when you skip through the thread.

This one simple feature has changed 4chan. Before, posts are similar and anonymous since they don't have visual distinction between each other. You have to actually read their content to know what's inside. The reply indicator make controversial posts very visible and "famous" in the thread.

Much like Reddit's voting system and Facebook likes or Twitter's retweets/favorites, 4chan now has its own post rating system. The difference is that Facebook likes and Reddit's vote system rewards popular posts that people agree with and liked. 4chan's "rating system" rewards controversial posts that people rebuke or laugh at.

The presence of this reply indicator make people try to post controversial contents, and to be controversial by 4chan standards, your post have to be very, very controversial.

  • the8472 10 years ago

    I speculate that the ban on raids had a much bigger impact. Before that they were used for all kinds of things, mostly to cause mischief, occasionally even for a good purpose, e.g. op chanology. So this might have tied up and channeled a lot of the mischievous energy of the more active users. Now that it's banned we get more informal, less organized hit-and-run harassment.

    • Pigo 10 years ago

      I miss the BattleToads threads, especially when they would record their calls to the Pawn Stars and GameStop stores. Or just visiting 4chanarchive to watch drama unfold in some previously massive thread. There just isn't anything like it on the Internet still, as far as I'm aware. Unless you enjoy a 'LIK DIS IF YOU CRY EVERTIM' Facebook post.

      • sotojuan 10 years ago

        Last thing I remember being like that was the Baneposting raid on a Reddit AMA.

  • kakarot 10 years ago

    Posts linking their replies in the header has been a feature for a very, very long time. This doesn't have the negative impact you think it does. It's not a post rating system, and only trolls and candyasses pay attention to the number of replies on your post.

    There isn't any kind of long-term karma game like on other sites. 4chan is still content-heavy and shit posts are still looked down upon by the larger community. It may not seem that way, but the stupidest people are often the loudest.

    • ivariousOP 10 years ago

      >Posts linking their replies in the header has been a feature for a very, very long time.

      Before, that was add-on/userscript feature. Since moot adopted them into 4chan's codebase, everyone has it.

      >only trolls and candyasses pay attention to the number of replies on your post

      Exactly. This feature encourages and rewards trolls and people who fish for replies.

      >There isn't any kind of long-term karma game like on other sites. 4chan is still content-heavy and shit posts are still looked down upon by the larger community.

      The dynamic of the discussion changes though. Even a slight nod matters in a long run considering that 4chan's culture evolves in a very rapid pace, thanks to its ephemerality and anonymity.

      >

      Come on.

      • kakarot 9 years ago

        After Hacker News, 4chan is the only non-specific community I enjoy, due to how it manages threads it's easy to sift past shitposts and find the good stuff. All of the problems you present aren't really representative of the actual 4chan experience. I'm sorry you haven't figured out how to make it work for you.

  • flgr 10 years ago

    Interestingly, Facebook's algorithms also reward activity which has the effect of bubbling up group posts with a lot of drama.

  • MichaelGG 10 years ago

    The addition of flags probably do far more damage to /pol/. Too much meta discussion or just insults based on the flag of the poster.

  • RGamma 10 years ago

    No, it's disappointing that 4ch is getting any attention, because attention has always been the cancer that is killing X. I suppose network effects can also work against you...

dogma1138 10 years ago

"9. RARE PEPES In this Section we display some of our rare Pepe collection."

Things that you have never thought would appear on a bonafide research paper for 800$.

EDIT: 4Chan thread regarding this paper, this is worth the read on it's own. http://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/92612923/a-longitudinal-m...

  • mafribe 10 years ago

    This sentence -- not to mention the rare pepe collection at the end -- made me pause a bit and wonder if the paper isn't a particularly elaborate chan troll. Clearly "rare pepe" is a chan in-joke.

    • dogma1138 10 years ago

      Rare Pepe is the "name" of the meme as far as the subject specific custom pepe images/shops go.

      But I still can't believe that there is a research paper out there where there is a section which describes the researcher's "collection" of rare pepe memes with visual aide samples.

      • douche 10 years ago

        I can't believe that a presidential candidate prominently featured a page on their website attacking a stupid internet meme. I think the Aztecs fudged their calculations somehow, and it was really supposed to be 2016...

    • ivariousOP 10 years ago

      Not to mention the rickroll in page 2.

  • loeber 10 years ago

    The best is Footnote 2: "For readers unfamiliar with memes, we suggest a review of the documentary available at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ ."

  • hacker42 10 years ago

    Remember that arXiv is just pre-print and the last page if not the entire paper is probably nothing more than a lame/distasteful joke. Remember that any nutbag who knows a little English and LaTeX can publish on arXiv. It will likely not make it into a journal.

    • dylanfw 10 years ago

      Seeing "LaTeX" (lay-tech) and "arXiv" together in your sentence made me finally realize that arXiv is pronounced "archive". I've been reading it as "arx-iv" for years.

      • eclyps19 10 years ago

        It's really not pronounced "lay-tecks"? Damn, I've been pronouncing that incorrectly for years, then.

        • adrianN 10 years ago

          LaTeX: /ˈlɑːtɛx/ LAH-tekh, also pronounced as /ˈlɑːtɛk/ LAH-tek or /ˈleɪtɛk/ LAY-tek

          • mturmon 10 years ago

            Knuth, in his book, memorably decreed a pronunciation (and case mixing in the written form) for TeX, with a hard /ch/ at the end (literally, "your monitor should become slightly moist"), backed by a clever and erudite rationale involving the etymology of words like technique.

            Leslie Lamport, in his book on LaTeX, decreed a case mixing, but (as you say) ok'd any reasonable pronunciation.

        • verandaguy 10 years ago

          Originally, a TeX user would've been called a TeXnician, which, according to Don Knuth, would be pronounced the same as "technician."

        • nickpsecurity 10 years ago

          I guess we're in the same boat on that one. It's a weird pronunciation, though, so it barely counts against us. ;)

      • vidarh 10 years ago

        Archive is spelled "arkiv" in several languages, and the etymology goes back (via latin) to the Greek ἀρχεῖον (arkheîon), so it's a quite clever name.

        • coldpie 10 years ago

          Where "clever" is a synonym for "needlessly unintuitive." Not that I'm complaining.

      • coldpie 10 years ago

        Took me a long time to figure out that NGINX is not supposed to be spelled out.

      • socialist_coder 10 years ago

        > I've been reading it as "arx-iv" for years.

        Same. You've blown my mind!

    • wnkrshm 10 years ago

      It is not entirely a free-for all (as in, anyone can submit papers), there is an endorsement system [1]. Of course, it's only networking and who-knows-who - but there is controversy, as in established contributors think that the endorsement system is too high a barrier.

      [1] https://arxiv.org/help/endorsement

    • dogma1138 10 years ago

      Not sure, I think it will make it in, also the response from 4chan was pretty funny via one of the authors. https://twitter.com/jhblackb/status/786301793064017920

    • herge 10 years ago

      It's almost as bad as HackerNews comments

jmcgough 10 years ago

I've been really surprised how influential /pol/ has been this election, which has been really weird and a little scary. It's not uncommon to post something on 4chan stating that you have inside information on events that are going to happen over the next few days (which is fiction 99.9% of the time). Posts like this in /pol/ have been getting screenshotted and spread elsewhere on the web, where alt-right conspiracy nuts are latching on to them.

I've tried explaining to a few people that it's 4chan and you can't take it seriously, but they're convinced that these posts are real.

  • Tsugumo 10 years ago

    In the words of one /pol/ poster:

    "/pol/ is winning because it's funnier than the people that despise it, it's that simple. Being authoritarian isn't funny. Tumblr, leddit, they're funny like a commercial is funny, they can be clever, they can be witty, but they'll never be gut-laugh, -holy shit- funny, because they never confront anything they're not supposed to, they never color outside the lines. They talk like they're resisting something, but all they do is agree with each other. They slay the sacred cows they've been conditioned to hate, and they ignore the elephants in the room they're conditioned not to see, and they'll always be like that because they're clever, educated pussies.

    /pol/ is full of angry racist conspiracy theorists, but it's fucking hilarious. /pol/ might not always tell you the truth, but it will tell you the closest thing to an honest truth it can see, and it will laugh at you for being offended by it. The fact that /pol/ is starting to influence 4chan in general means that the sacred cows we're slaying are actually sacred, and people are laughing in spite of themselves. It's stupid and weird and it's too simplistic and old-fashioned to be true, but you're laughing anyways.

    That's how it begins."

  • alva 10 years ago

    Indeed a couple of posts made in the last few months have been prescient of serious and highly secretive information. The motivation behind such posters is likely explained below.

    I think what a lot of people don't get about /pol/'s influence in the last year is it's mechanism. It is easy to browse the site as an outsider and think it is just shitposting 9000, with no real influence outside. However /pol/ unconsciously and without formal direction has an extremely effective strategy for disseminating information.

    Once the essence of some information has been distilled users start disseminating it to the 'normies' via Reddit and Twitter. Twitter is where the real influence comes as they inevitably target journalists in large numbers. As most know, journalists and politicians are extremely engaged in Twitter. Stories frequently then cross the barrier into the mainstream.

    Targeting of journalists and politicians, largely but not always via Twitter, is where most of the huge power is derived. People targeted don't necessarily have the internet experience to realise when these things are directed. A lot of what most of them see is a flurry of regular public concern which needs to be addressed.

    When a story from /pol/ reaches the mainstream, it goes into a glorious frenzy. It is a powerful feeling when something you have created/discovered and disseminated in a 4chan thread becomes international news because of the boards collective action.

    Summarised: when a very large group of people with political leanings on a story/topic informally organise, the effort can take the view mainstream. important to note is the demographic includes a diverse group of users who are highly skilled in programming, social media and politics.

    edit: If I was a highly placed politician and wanted to disseminate secret information without attribution, I would run it through the tumbler that is 4chan.

    • hulahoof 9 years ago

      Thanks for the edit I was reading this tired and the edit tied the post together

  • colordrops 10 years ago

    /pol/ uncovered the Paul Combetta posts on Reddit. So it's not all bullshit. Its crazy that they had enough of an effect to get the head of the FBI grilled by a house committee.

    • AvenueIngres 10 years ago

      /pol/:/sg/ helped the Russian airforce identify rebels positions in Syria and destroy them. It is not all bullshit at all; there is a significant proportion of it that is undeniably childish garbage but there is the occasional gem as well.

      • cryoshon 10 years ago

        source? if true, this would be a troubling precedent in the use of third party analysis in conducting military operations

        • AvenueIngres 10 years ago

          I occasionally lurk on 4chan (in particular /sg/ since they aggregate lots of data regarding the Syrian civil war) and I witnessed this one particular event first hand. Now I understand that this is not a verifiable source but I found this as well, that sums-up the whole thing: http://2static.fjcdn.com/pictures/4chan+pol+sg+orders+an+air...

          I don't think you will be able to find anything better than that to "prove" it happened.

          • astrodust 10 years ago

            Giving military "intel" from 4chan is absolutely insane. These were the same people that thought they'd conclusively identified the Boston Marathon bomber, but were totally wrong.

            • niftich 10 years ago
              • sixo 10 years ago

                Just for the record, reddit ran with it after picking it up from (I think) the police scanner.

                • niftich 10 years ago

                  This is true. I remember firsthand the #scanner hashtag on Twitter and various re-streamers broadcasting the scanner online, as CNN and other outlets were trying to confirm facts and keep up coverage.

                  It was a surreal experience, and it showed both the strengths and weaknesses of crowdsourced tweets as "news". You get a lot of info, about how people think and feel but the facts being thrown about can be faulty and need to be confirmed independently. It wasn't until the unfortunate events in Ferguson a year and a half later than a similar kind and intensity of social media coverage ensued.

              • astrodust 10 years ago

                I'm sure 4chan is held to a higher standard.

            • AvenueIngres 10 years ago

              It's not like they could send UAVs to verify if the claims are legit? It's literally written on the screenshot that the Russians sent drones; and Ivan is obviously a Russian intelligence officer. Breathe!

              • astrodust 10 years ago

                Russians have demonstrated time and time again they will shoot first and ask questions later, and many times they don't even bother asking questions.

                US intelligence is not always as rigorous, either, don't get me wrong, but the Russians in Syria seem to have very loose definitions of what qualifies as a target.

        • konart 10 years ago

          https://www.reddit.com/r/4chan/comments/4deu8r/pol_helps_coo...

          Can't find a better source. But this was the second time RuAF bombed the rebles camp after third party analysis (might be a coincidence ofc). There was a different image with Russian MoD's report on the matter.

        • v64 10 years ago

          Not sure how much of this, if any, has been corroborated, but this [1] is a description of the events.

          [1] http://www.vocativ.com/326039/how-one-4chan-board-is-trying-...

    • gragas 10 years ago

      I was in the original thread and got screens of Combetta's history before he deleted it. I see /pol/ as one of the last bastions of political discussion that's not flooded with liberal propaganda, though that has been changing lately with CTR.

    • jmcgough 10 years ago

      That's part of the frustration for me - 0.1% of the time they uncover something of real value that no one else noticed. It's just that 99.9% of the time it's just noise, memes and conspiracy theories. I guess that's why people keep coming back to the forum.

  • Freak_NL 10 years ago

    It's fascinating to see how feasible it is to get something — anything — recognized as fact or actual trend by employing social media and excitable media. The 'bikini bridge' phenomenon comes to mind.

  • awesomerobot 10 years ago

    That's kind of the crux of 4chan — you can't take it seriously, but it's very serious.

NietTim 10 years ago

Can someone explain to me why they keep focussing on 4chan and not 'chans' in general? AFAIK 8chan's /pol/ has had a bigger impact this time around because they censor less. (Not censoring doxx information and such)

  • nickthemagicman 10 years ago

    Most average people don't even know what a 'chan' is or even know what 4chan is all about, except for the times it gets demonized by the media. And it becomes just associated with something sensational and negative.

    The higher ideal: the philosophical context of freedom through anonymity resulting in great creativity is completely drowned out by the petty stuff.

    There's a reason it creates a major portion of culture,memes, and ideas on the internet. It's one of the few places unimpenged by materialism or status or th ability of your boss to find your account. This means every one is simply judged by what ideas they create and I think thats a beautiful thing.

    • SOLAR_FIELDS 10 years ago

      This means every one is simply judged by what ideas they create and I think thats a beautiful thing.

      And it drives higher quality content because of it. Most people do not realize that a lot of the popular memes and internet jokes shared on more mainstream platforms originally came from the "chan" culture.

      To your point though the high quality content is often difficult to find in the cesspool of low-quality spam on these boards.

      • Trombone12 10 years ago

        Lets be honest: memes aren't high quality content when compared to the types of free content available on the net.

        4chan has spawned a lot of memes because it was one of the earliest places people appreciated that sort of low-effort anyone-could-do-it content, but to say it drives high quality content is to decry any competently drawn stick figure as bourgeois.

        • ivariousOP 10 years ago

          Considering that one of internet's strength is the democratization of content creation, low-effort anyone-could-do-it contents are inherently high quality.

      • bhaumik 10 years ago

        Besides memes and internet jokes, what are examples of high quality content created (or originating) from the "chan" culture?

        • NotaSockPuppet8 10 years ago

          /g/ makes useful software on occasion for example. after 4chan pioneered webm as looping gif replacement (long before imgur doing the gifv thing) they made webmcam and webm4retards for example. The latter by its mere existence also highlighted github's overzealous application of community policies.

          A bunch of indie games started their life there too.

          And then there are derivative and mashup works like fanart, translations.

          I only visit a few boards, so i'm probably missing a lot.

          • pierrebai 10 years ago

            But we could apply the reverse Sturgeon's law: in any sufficiently large community, 1% of content will not be crap. 4chan is not special, it's just large.

            • nickthemagicman 10 years ago

              Facebook is my counter example. Its the biggest social media site on the internet. Produces nothing that gets reified in the form of internet culture.

              • internaut 10 years ago

                magicman, academia should study why Facebook is a sterile wasteland

                4chan, Reddit and HN are Internet natives.

                Facebook and Twitter are fucking tourists.

                • nickthemagicman 9 years ago

                  Facebook is what mainstream compares 4chan to. A nice safe sterile place. Good for family values and advertising.

            • Vaskivo 10 years ago

              But it's size together with the temporary aspect of it's content greatly accelerates the iteration process, culling bad content and refining the good one.

          • DarkLinkXXXX 10 years ago

            Actually, 8chan had webm embeds before 4chan (and with a higher size limit). They were first AFAIK, but maybe some smaller chan did it sooner.

        • Kristine1975 10 years ago

          The visual novel (think "Choose your own adventure with graphics") Katawa Shoujo, while not made by anons, has its origins on 4chan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katawa_Shoujo#Creation

        • qwertyuiop924 10 years ago

          Adeptus Evangelion, Chapter Master, and Ruby Quest all came from 4chan's /tg/.

        • cache-monet 10 years ago

          Most people don't know, but Tox (just posted here a few days ago [1]) started on /g/.

          [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12657891

        • Paul_S 10 years ago

          There's the vidya gaem awards, an alternative to the mainstream awards ceremony.

        • Paul_S 10 years ago

          I Ii

          II I_

          • Grue3 10 years ago

            Pretty sure the Loss.jpg obsession started with Something Awful.

            • Paul_S 10 years ago

              Despite vehement protestations on both sides, the population overlap is more than substantial.

              There's clearly even some overlap with HN.

  • nv-vn 10 years ago

    All the chans have pretty different culture. For example, 8chan seems to have a higher rate of reddit cross-posting. Lainchan, as another example, is meant to be closer to older 4chan culture and has very few users who are "new" to chans.

    • qwertyuiop924 10 years ago

      Lainchan actually seems like a genuinely interesting site, with a better signal:noise ration than 4chan. Thanks for the link.

      • nv-vn 10 years ago

        It's very nice, however much too inactive for most people to use regularly.

        • angersock 10 years ago

          Which is good. Fuck most people. They can stay here and on Le Reddit

          • qwertyuiop924 10 years ago

            HN isn't so bad... Reddit, that's debatable. Some think it's too PC, and others think it's not PC enough. Myself, I miss the days when communication platforms like Usenet could be common carriers.

hex12648430 10 years ago

If you are a researcher looking for a 4chan dataset spanning a much longer time period and many different boards, I would recommend looking into the archive.moe database dump[0] that was uploaded to the Internet Archive after the owner decided to stop his activities.

[0]: https://archive.org/download/archive-moe-database-201506

  • JD557 10 years ago

    I was recently working on a project to identify pepes in images and dumped a bunch of images from the /r9k/ archive using the 4chan API.

    If you are a researcher looking for a 4chan dataset for supervised learning, be aware that labeling the images is not a task for the faint of heart.

    When you browse an image board, you will have an implicit image filter: you will probably only open threads that interest you and that have been alive for a while. That does not hold for an image dump of all threads.

sparkling 10 years ago

By November 8th, /pol/ will have successfully memed a man into the white house, mark my words.

thrwaway656 10 years ago

This paper was shared on /pol/, here's a link to the (archived) thread if you're interested in reading the responses.

http://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/92760043/

  • rhaps0dy 10 years ago

    Some of the replies to the thread show mistakes in the paper.

    For example, Zimbabwe is marked as very active and very hateful. But it's probably just people with a VPN: doing that to get a "controversial" or "funny" country flag is a thing.

    • AssadianSkpe 10 years ago

      Zimbabwe was known as South Rhodesia. South Rhodesia, to pol, is very significant culturally.

kyrre 10 years ago

academic shitposting is still shitposting

fingar 10 years ago

These students are funded anyway and decided to add a publication on an area they love.

They included their funding bodies because it is required by their funding agreement.

trevelyan 10 years ago

How does it take eight people to write this paper?

  • pmyteh 10 years ago

    Two people collected the data, two did the analysis and wrote the paper, three helped a bit, one got the grant which funded the lab. Or something similar.

    The incentives for giving credit to everyone who participated even a bit are quite strong: in most academic disciplines you get more than an eighth of a paper's worth of 'credit' for an eight-author paper.

  • egjerlow 10 years ago

    From my experiences in astrophysics: Second author is supervisor, third, fourth, etc. are previous collaborators of supervisor that somehow have some 'moral' claim to supervisor's work because it remotely thematically touches upon previous work they did, and thus have provided 'inspiration' for the current work. It's a racket ;)

  • Millennium 10 years ago

    Four people to study /pol/ in depth, and four people to be the trauma therapists keeping them sane.

  • mafribe 10 years ago

    It's quite popular in the NGO/SJW world to do informal "manus manum lavat" deals to gain credibility: you help us with our current campaign, we put your name on our future publications.

  • contergan 10 years ago

    Well, somehow that tax payer money has to be put to use. I love the rare Pepe collection at the end of this paper.

  • jackcosgrove 10 years ago

    One per chan.

lake99 10 years ago

Figure 15 with heat map of hate speech per post puts India, Pakistan, Thailand, Belarus, Zimbabwe, and South Korea as the leaders of the pack. In my limited experience on /pol, this paints a very misleading picture. I hardly ever see people from these countries posting there. (See Figure 4.) They can't just leave the figure as-is, without further explanation.

The posters on 4chan (see dogma1138's post) are as surprised as I am that India features at all. To the contrary, India is commonly the target of scatological jokes.

Although they acknowledge the use of VPN, they might be downplaying its usage. Without making an effort to disambiguate that (with assistance from 4chan admins) I don't see the point of making charts based on countries. If not disambiguate, discarding posts by Tor and VPN users is easy enough.

I can't help but agree with the poster who wrote:

>>Although it is a bit absurd, /pol/ has, some

>>how, managed to place itself at the center of >world politics.

> i can't continue reading this, this is insane.

  • saint_fiasco 10 years ago

    If you are in the US, keep in mind that those countries are in distant timezones. Because 4chan threads are so ephemeral, they could have entire threads to themselves while you are asleep and you wouldn't notice.

Waterluvian 10 years ago

Hate words by country is the most interesting part for me. I really want to see a deeper study done on that.

  • NotaSockPuppet8 10 years ago

    "Hate" is really not the right word in this context, as a lot of them are thrown around casually. Not necessarily due to deep-seated hatred but simply because it is not politically correct to use the words. To gain a sense of being contrarian to the mainstream, to titillate, to watch the reactions of those offended.

    For example the "-fag" suffix is applied to everything and practically synonymous with "-person". A namefag is someone who uses a username instead of remaining anonymous. A drawfag is someone who creates original art, it has a positive connotation.

    Even when discussing unfair monetary things the term kikes (jews) might be thrown around, just due to the historic association of jews with banking. Even users who present left-leaning positions (e.g. on renewable energy, healthcare or defense spending) use those terms because the associated concepts are ingrained in the conversation structure.

    I don't know about /pol/, but other boards use "my nigger" or humorous variations thereof as an expression of endorsement

    Use of the words might correlate with the sentiment of the user, but the correlation may be weaker than expected.

norea-armozel 10 years ago

I don't like to be mean but I honestly don't see /pol/ has a big influence in the election or politics like some commentors have stated. First, most of the action /pol/ does outside of their board is mostly on Twitter and various open polls. I've never seen /pol/ do anything close to real life action. Not a single event or protest IRL. Not even a letter writing campaign. Just posting image macros. It's all in good fun I'm sure, but they're not going to change the opinions of voter blocs with Rare Pepes that's for sure.

  • AssadianSkpe 10 years ago

    Richard Spencer once said that politics to culture is mist to a lake. You cannot have politics without having culture. IRL actions are not gonna do squat (see: ows, arab spring) without cultural shifts. What pol is doing is more insidious in effect: it is shifting the culture that will enable the politics. If 4chan reach in memes is wide, as internet history has shown, and if the memes from pol become sentiments embraced by others outside of it, pol is creating the lake for whatever mist.

    To change politics, it requires a cultural change. Tumblr is another place on the internet that is a space for cultural change, albeit the opposite kind.

zerognowl 10 years ago

Not forgetting 4chan's evil twin brother 8chan:

https://8ch.net/pol/index.html

And for more chans, look no further than:

https://encyclopediadramatica.se/List_of_chans

Whilst I appreciate 4chan was the original chan that started all the other chans off, people often forget the alternatives. A common complaint of the alternative chans is that 4chan has become too conservative and is too heavily moderated. Does anyone agree?

denzil_correa 10 years ago

I know a lot of researchers who avoid 4chan due to fear. Given that context, in some sense this seems to be a bold step.

EJTH 10 years ago

To be fair, /pol/ is one of the best places to get happening news (Information about terror attacks that would otherwise be censored by mass media, information from the Syria conflict etc)

There is a lot of shilling and a lot of trolling... It seems to me that /pol/ posts has become >50% shitposting from trolls and shills and less political discussion.

The real influx of users into pol started with the european refugee crisis, not the presidential elections.

  • Vaskivo 10 years ago

    Every board in 4chan has it's amount of shitposting. One thing you start developing, as a user, is an semiconscious filter and ways to process the information.

    A *chan site has many layers a user must go through to finally fing a decent discussion (or the epic lulz). You have an outdated confusing UI, the sheer amount of useless content, the lingo and the highly offensive content.

    After you learn to process and filter all that, you start finding the really good stuff. Or, as I like to say, "Gold floats on shit. You just have to be brave and reach it"

    • qwertyuiop924 10 years ago

      /tg/ had a gentler introduction than most, as the Very Best of /tg/ is published on 1d4chan, so you start by seeing the very best of what the chan has to offer.

  • Senji 10 years ago

    There was that one time when posters from the Syria general thread helped by looking up images on google earth and had an artillery strike directed.

    • Joeboy 10 years ago

      Can you (or somebody) explain this? It sounds interesting but I don't understand exactly what that sentence means.

      • 3dk 10 years ago

        Here you go: http://imgur.com/gallery/5P1N1GI

        Summary: 4 chan users identified a training site of ISIS and pinpointed it on google maps. One of the users knows a friend of the Russian Minister of Defense and sent him the information, resulting in an air strike.

        • astrodust 10 years ago

          This is disturbing to say the least. Which group of "rebels" is this? There's a lot of factions here in play, some of which are downright scary, but others of which are just fighting to survive.

          Not that 4chan cares about these things. They just want to see people blown up.

          • AvenueIngres 10 years ago

            >Not that 4chan cares about these things. They just want to see people blown up.

            You understand 4chan isn't a single hive mind right? Each board has its own culture, and even moreso: each general thread has it own subculture. /sg/ (Syria General) is one of the best place to get data on the Syrian civil war. The folks there aggregate data from a massive set of sources and include people who actually live in Syria or can speak arabic.

            So you know, instead of parroting the same spam all around this thread. Maybe you should take two seconds to appreciate that you neither understand nor are willing to make an attempt at understanding what goes on there.

            • astrodust 10 years ago

              The problem with communities, online and otherwise, is they develop a certain prevailing attitude. These can either be weak (e.g. Reddit, 4chan) or strong (e.g. /r/The_Donald, /pol/) depending on how you delineate these.

              You can make a case that /sg/ is a good source of news, but it's part of 4chan. I'd rather follow individuals doing reporting on something more neutral like Twitter.

              • AssadianSkpe 10 years ago

                pol has a general stance towards the war in syria: america needs to GTFO it and let russia and syria deal with it (this stance predated Trump's). The rebels, and whom they are, are seen just as rebels. /sg/ is pro-assad. The fact this 'bias' exist doesn't mean it isn't a good source of information. Many neural parties quote something known as the Syrian human rights observatory, or participate/gain information from networks of dissemination more aligned to western narratives of the war, information that cannot be de-intermediated from those who pass them along. /sg/ is not aligned to that narrative.

                Astrodust, I think your understanding of politics and journalism is naive and one that deserves a thorough rehabilitation through a deep deep engagement with pol.

                /sg/ teaches anyone who dare engages with it that information, collection, dissemination, acting upon it, appreciating it, comes from collective intentions (not attitudes, reddit cultivates attitudes; 4chan cultivates intentions, the dynamic of the whole raiding culture, the whole you must do to participate instead of merely like/solicit likes aspect) and, if you become acquainted with pol, you will learn viscerally what collective intentions look like, you will see it elsewhere.

                Reddit is for the cuck, it is a circle jerk. the lack of identification, liking mechanism, and the culture of anonymity makes it less about affirming attitudes and more about intentions and the lack of moderation on chans is why/how intentions compete.

                to repeat: intentions vs attitudes. narratives vs bias.

                the differences between these concepts become incredibly illuminated if you engage with pol.

                • astrodust 9 years ago

                  If this is some hack-ass pitch for /pol/ and how great it is, you're failing. If there's anyone there that knows what they're doing, they're drowned out in a sea of idiots.

                  Plus, if you're going to play the "cuck" card, this conversation is over. I'm so tired of that shit.

                  • AssadianSkpe 9 years ago

                    >so tired of that shit >ugh, why am i cuck >screw this person's points, he thinks I am a cuck therefore his points are invalid >ugh pol makes me resent myself

                    ok big boi

      • NotaSockPuppet8 10 years ago

        It appears I can only find a version that has experienced some jpeg rot, but it should still be good enough to do the explaining:

        https://my.mixtape.moe/lnuyms.jpg

      • praptak 10 years ago

        Probably someone had a photo of a possible target but didn't know the location so they crowdsourced that to 4chan.

ue_ 10 years ago

If you look at the remnants of the earlier chans (created between 1 and 3 years after 4chan) which never really gained much momentum, you'll see that they had a much different culture at the time. In a way I wish we could return to this idea of the "small chan", as a way of escaping the grinding politics and hate culture that's on some boards (like /pol/) which tends to leak over (jokingly or not) to the other boards.

  • ivariousOP 10 years ago

    I still remember when moot first created [s4s] a lot of people say that it can be a reset to the old chan culture.

ZoF 10 years ago

Handing over ICANN control to the UN was a mistake.

I have very little faith that this won't be used to censor free speech in the not-so-distant future.

acqq 10 years ago

It really looks like wasted money, if it was really financed and is not an elaborate trolling.

  • rhaps0dy 10 years ago

    I think the money was totally worth it, just for the fun we all had. It's a lot of people having fun.

    Although maybe the people who don't know about this (thus couldn't have fun) shouldn't have paid for it :\

    • acqq 10 years ago

      So was it really financed from the tax money of Europeans? If it was, I am really sad. Then the authors shouldn't be proud of such an "achievement."

      If it was generated by the 4chan regulars with their own money, then at least it's not worth discussing it more here...

      • rconti 10 years ago

        It makes me sad that every time any kind of research is done, someone has to denigrate it as a waste of money.

        While I don't care about "chan" culture (never visited one of the sites, don't need that in my life), I fully support research into things I may or may not like. Let the Universities decide where to spend their research budgets. You never know what will come out of it.

      • totony 10 years ago

        Or Europe should stop giving away their taxpayers money :)

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